Lurking009
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Now that June 25th has come and gone... thoughts?
Church Rapture on 25 June 2021
- Thread starter Kaidyeg
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Red Sky at Morning
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I started another thread entitled “high watch times” a while back….
This was the first post:-
I have often heard the phrase from Matthew 24:36 used in conjunction with the return of the Lord:-
"But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only."
Jesus infers to the Church of Sardis in Revelation 3 that he will come upon them as a thief in the night...
"Remember therefore how you have received and heard; hold fast and repent. Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you."
On the other hand, there is an element of ambiguity as 1 Thessalonians 5 seems to suggest there may be believers who are not overtaken as a thief...
4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.b7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. 8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. 9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him."
The Gospels record records of some who were expecting the first advent of Jesus. Simeon and Anna perhaps didn't know exactly when He would arrive but they had an idea on it. Maybe they were aware of the prophecy of Daniels 70 weeks? For me, and others, this is where the concept of "high watch times" comes in...
YouTube is full of speculation on possible dates based on patterns people have spotted which may have significance. Some sounds crazy, other are very thoughtful. It's easy to make fun of them but I'm sure the folk who looked for the coming Messiah the first time had a similar reaction.
The feasts of the Lord pattern the key interactions with Jesus in world history.
Every year the "Fall Feasts" pattern future events that will one day come on some as a thief in the night, and to others as their hearts desire. These are "high watch times" but not to be confused with over-confident date-setting predictions.
For years, well meaning Christians have taken possibilities and turned them into confident but incorrect predictions. So much mocking has followed. The way I have come to think about it is that if you were to be waiting at a station for a train coming in a long, deep valley, you would hear echoes long before the train itself arrived.
Of course, those who reject the "blessed hope" will pour scorn and contempt on such "logic" but Jesus never promised that following Him would make you particularly popular!
Perhaps those who have been watching for that train for a while will take my meaning.
Lurking009
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Agreed. If Christians are following the Bible, the Second Coming should absolutely not be a shock to them.
I could be misunderstanding you [apologies if so], but I was asking a serious question when I asked "thoughts?". Seriously... what comes after another failed prophecy and teaching? What happens to the people who were taken in and trusted that 'word'? What happens when non-believers see yet another lie being told by someone who claims to know and speak for God? Nothing good comes of these lies... ever.
But there's no way to whitewash over the fact that 'confident but incorrect predictions' still equals dangerous false teachings, though. If a Christian is truly well-meaning, they would simply follow the Bible and not claim to have a date, you know?
Mr. Awe obviously is personable, fun, and presents very well. His video is enjoyable. But all the charisma in the world did not make him correct in his prophecy and teachings, and he is therefore - very unfortunately - false.
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The Rapture Doctrine and Its Origin
What is the doctrine of the rapture? Simply put, it is the teaching that Jesus Christ will return twice! First, there will be a secret, unheralded return in which He will whisk all Christians, both living and dead, off to Heaven to be present there during the time that the Great Tribulation is taking place on earth. This secret coming supposedly could occur at any moment and will come without any advance warning to anyone. Seven years later (or three and a half according to some) Christ will return openly in power and glory to destroy the wicked and to establish His Kingdom.
The term "rapture" is used nowhere in the Bible. It is a term that has been invented by men and applied by them to what they term "the first phase" of the Second Coming. The Bible itself, however, nowhere says that Christ’s coming will occur in phases.
A nineteenth-century British preacher, John Nelson Darby, was the one who developed the rapture teaching and began to promote it in the 1830s. He was the founder of the Plymouth Brethren Church and developed a scheme of scriptural interpretation called dispensationalism. The idea of the dispensationalists is that God has had different rules for different groups at different times. For instance, He had the law for the Jews and now we have grace for the Church.
Darby’s teachings were refined and popularized by C. I. Scofield, an American lawyer and minister who authored the noted Scofield Reference Bible at the beginning of the twentieth century. Primarily through Dr. Scofield, Protestant evangelicals came to generally accept the teachings of both dispensationalism and the secret rapture. These two ideas go hand in hand to blind many sincere people to God’s real message to Christians in the end time.
Link
From the early Christian church to the nineteenth century Christians had never taught or believed in the rapture. Then Darby invented the doctrine and now millions of Christians believe in it despite the fact that none of the prophets, Jesus Himself (God) or the apostles ever spoke or wrote of it.
What is the doctrine of the rapture? Simply put, it is the teaching that Jesus Christ will return twice! First, there will be a secret, unheralded return in which He will whisk all Christians, both living and dead, off to Heaven to be present there during the time that the Great Tribulation is taking place on earth. This secret coming supposedly could occur at any moment and will come without any advance warning to anyone. Seven years later (or three and a half according to some) Christ will return openly in power and glory to destroy the wicked and to establish His Kingdom.
The term "rapture" is used nowhere in the Bible. It is a term that has been invented by men and applied by them to what they term "the first phase" of the Second Coming. The Bible itself, however, nowhere says that Christ’s coming will occur in phases.
A nineteenth-century British preacher, John Nelson Darby, was the one who developed the rapture teaching and began to promote it in the 1830s. He was the founder of the Plymouth Brethren Church and developed a scheme of scriptural interpretation called dispensationalism. The idea of the dispensationalists is that God has had different rules for different groups at different times. For instance, He had the law for the Jews and now we have grace for the Church.
Darby’s teachings were refined and popularized by C. I. Scofield, an American lawyer and minister who authored the noted Scofield Reference Bible at the beginning of the twentieth century. Primarily through Dr. Scofield, Protestant evangelicals came to generally accept the teachings of both dispensationalism and the secret rapture. These two ideas go hand in hand to blind many sincere people to God’s real message to Christians in the end time.
Link
From the early Christian church to the nineteenth century Christians had never taught or believed in the rapture. Then Darby invented the doctrine and now millions of Christians believe in it despite the fact that none of the prophets, Jesus Himself (God) or the apostles ever spoke or wrote of it.
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Karlysymon
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Not date setting here but something i've thought about for awhile is...
...Maybe this whole experiment with sin was meant to last a week (in God's eyes). If biblically 1 day=1000 years, then technically, it's been 6 days/6000yrs uptil this point in time. The millenium would make it the 7th day/7000yrs, after which everything would be renewed.
There are some verses that indicate that during the 7th day (on which God rested)/millenium, the earth will enjoy a sabbath rest after 6000yrs (or 6 days) of turmoil.
"All the lands are at rest and at peace; they break into singing. Even the pine trees and cedars of Lebanon exult over you and say, now that you've been laid low, no woodsman comes to cut us down." Isaiah 14:7-8 (see also Leviticus 26:33-35 , 2 Chronicles 36:21 and Revelation 20:7)
The rapture is not written of in the Bible at all. There is no verse in the Bible that even mentions it. Neither do the prophets, Jesus or the apostles ever mention it. They only talk about the one and only second coming of Christ.
Most Christians who believe in the rapture think its the truth that they will dismiss this without actually checking out for themselves whether its true or not from the Word of God.
I have a few questions:
- Do you believe EVERYTHING your Pastors tell you?
- Should you believe everything your Pastor tells you without question, without checking what the Word of God says to prove that what they are telling you is the truth of God like the Bereans did in the book of Acts?
It is regrettable that most Christians are content to get their knowledge of God's Word second hand. They don't study the Bible for themselves to know the truth of God themselves.
Christians who believe in the rapture use certain passages to prove their doctrine. Lets look at some of those passages and what they really mean.
1. John 14:1-3, "Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also."
These verses most definitely refer to the return of the Lord Jesus for his people, but there is no indication whatsoever that this coming will take place seven years before his visible return.
2. 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17, "But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus. For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord."
Certainly these verses speak to us of a rapture of the Church, but once again there is no suggestion at all that this rapture will take place at any other time than the Lord Jesus’ visible return. Actually verse 16 reads, “For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God.” Those words sound very much like the words of For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. Those words sound very much like the words of Matthew 24:31 which read, “And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.” This latter quotation is clearly referring to our Lord’s visible and glorious second coming which takes place at the end of this age,not seven years before the end of the age.
3. 2 Thessalonians.1:7-9, "and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power."
Again these verses are clearly referring to the Lord Jesus visible return, for verse 7 uses the words, “when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels.”
4. Jude 1:14-15, "Now Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men also, saying, “Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints, to execute judgment on all, to convict all who are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have committed in an ungodly way, and of all the harsh things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.”
These verses again refer to Christ’s visible return, not to some secret coming.
5. 1 Corinthians 15:14-15, "And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty and your faith is also empty. Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God, because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ, whom He did not raise up—if in fact the dead do not rise."
Again, as with 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 & Matthew 24:31, the last trumpet sounds and the dead saints rise are caught up in the air with the Lord along with the living saints, I see no evidence in these verses to suggest that this great event takes place at any other time than the glorious, visible return of Christ the second time.
6. Zechariah 14:1-5 these verses that talk about the Day of the Lord are referring to the third coming of Christ with the saints after the millennium. Christ comes with the saints the third time and His feet touch the earth , the second time He comes with all the angels of heaven and His feet do not touch the earth. The saints meet Him in the air. There is no mention of a rapture at all in these verses.
Sometimes Matthew 24:36-42 & Luke 17:26-29 are quoted in support the secret rapture doctrine, however a careful reading of these passages soon reveal that no secret rapture is being spoken about here at all.
7. Matthew 24:37-42, "But as the days of Noah were, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. Then two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left. Watch therefore, for you do not know what hour your Lord is coming."
These words, coming from the mouth of Jesus, tell us it is only when Jesus returns, that some will be "taken", while others will be left. It is only then, at the return of Jesus, that the righteous will be "taken." This next passage confirms this: "Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other" (Matthew 24:30-31).
8. Luke 17:26-29, "And as it was in the days of Noah, so it will be also in the days of the Son of Man: They ate, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all. Likewise as it was also in the days of Lot: They ate, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they built; but on the day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all."
Most people in the world were not prepared for the flood because they rejected Noah's message given to him by God. Like wise in the day of Lot people just continued in their sinful lives and even made plans for the future then sudden destruction. Only true Christians who are the minority (just as in Noah's days) will be prepared for Jesus' second coming. The whole world at that time saw the flood happening. There were no people being snatched up to heaven one day.
Revelation 1:7, "Behold, He is coming with clouds, and every eye will see Him, even they who pierced Him." Everyone on earth (the saved and unsaved) will know when Jesus returns the second time in glory.
The simple fact of the matter is that the Bible does not clearly teach the doctrine of the rapture at all, but dispensationalists have invented this teaching to support their own erroneous beliefs.
Most Christians who believe in the rapture think its the truth that they will dismiss this without actually checking out for themselves whether its true or not from the Word of God.
I have a few questions:
- Do you believe EVERYTHING your Pastors tell you?
- Should you believe everything your Pastor tells you without question, without checking what the Word of God says to prove that what they are telling you is the truth of God like the Bereans did in the book of Acts?
It is regrettable that most Christians are content to get their knowledge of God's Word second hand. They don't study the Bible for themselves to know the truth of God themselves.
Christians who believe in the rapture use certain passages to prove their doctrine. Lets look at some of those passages and what they really mean.
1. John 14:1-3, "Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also."
These verses most definitely refer to the return of the Lord Jesus for his people, but there is no indication whatsoever that this coming will take place seven years before his visible return.
2. 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17, "But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus. For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord."
Certainly these verses speak to us of a rapture of the Church, but once again there is no suggestion at all that this rapture will take place at any other time than the Lord Jesus’ visible return. Actually verse 16 reads, “For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God.” Those words sound very much like the words of For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. Those words sound very much like the words of Matthew 24:31 which read, “And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.” This latter quotation is clearly referring to our Lord’s visible and glorious second coming which takes place at the end of this age,not seven years before the end of the age.
3. 2 Thessalonians.1:7-9, "and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power."
Again these verses are clearly referring to the Lord Jesus visible return, for verse 7 uses the words, “when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels.”
4. Jude 1:14-15, "Now Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men also, saying, “Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints, to execute judgment on all, to convict all who are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have committed in an ungodly way, and of all the harsh things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.”
These verses again refer to Christ’s visible return, not to some secret coming.
5. 1 Corinthians 15:14-15, "And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty and your faith is also empty. Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God, because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ, whom He did not raise up—if in fact the dead do not rise."
Again, as with 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 & Matthew 24:31, the last trumpet sounds and the dead saints rise are caught up in the air with the Lord along with the living saints, I see no evidence in these verses to suggest that this great event takes place at any other time than the glorious, visible return of Christ the second time.
6. Zechariah 14:1-5 these verses that talk about the Day of the Lord are referring to the third coming of Christ with the saints after the millennium. Christ comes with the saints the third time and His feet touch the earth , the second time He comes with all the angels of heaven and His feet do not touch the earth. The saints meet Him in the air. There is no mention of a rapture at all in these verses.
Sometimes Matthew 24:36-42 & Luke 17:26-29 are quoted in support the secret rapture doctrine, however a careful reading of these passages soon reveal that no secret rapture is being spoken about here at all.
7. Matthew 24:37-42, "But as the days of Noah were, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. Then two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left. Watch therefore, for you do not know what hour your Lord is coming."
These words, coming from the mouth of Jesus, tell us it is only when Jesus returns, that some will be "taken", while others will be left. It is only then, at the return of Jesus, that the righteous will be "taken." This next passage confirms this: "Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other" (Matthew 24:30-31).
8. Luke 17:26-29, "And as it was in the days of Noah, so it will be also in the days of the Son of Man: They ate, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all. Likewise as it was also in the days of Lot: They ate, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they built; but on the day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all."
Most people in the world were not prepared for the flood because they rejected Noah's message given to him by God. Like wise in the day of Lot people just continued in their sinful lives and even made plans for the future then sudden destruction. Only true Christians who are the minority (just as in Noah's days) will be prepared for Jesus' second coming. The whole world at that time saw the flood happening. There were no people being snatched up to heaven one day.
Revelation 1:7, "Behold, He is coming with clouds, and every eye will see Him, even they who pierced Him." Everyone on earth (the saved and unsaved) will know when Jesus returns the second time in glory.
The simple fact of the matter is that the Bible does not clearly teach the doctrine of the rapture at all, but dispensationalists have invented this teaching to support their own erroneous beliefs.
Red Sky at Morning
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A few months ago I noticed that the gap between the death of Adam and the Flood was 726 years…
726 harpázō – properly, seize by force; snatch up, suddenly and decisively – like someone seizing bounty (spoil, a prize); to take by an open display of force (i.e. not covertly or secretly).
I also thought until a couple of months ago that the Strongs numbers were an arbitrary reference - turned out I was wrong:-
Strong's Concordance - Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org
It put me in mind of the familiar but cryptic words of Jesus from John 11…
25 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. 26 And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”
The last days are also counted as being prefigured by the days of Noah. Just pondering…
Anyone that sets a date is not talking truth. No one knows date & time PERIOD! However, we do know the season & harvest time has come and is going....winter is coming! They know it do you? Don't let anyone steal your crown for those that await HIS return. Also wasn't ENOCH around at the time of NOAH? So ENOCH walked with GOD then was no more sounds like the rapture? Precursor for a coming event? Yes i believe it is.
Tidal
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The whole Rapture Cult thing is wacko anyway because it's a good example of how people take a bible passage and twist it in the belief that only they can correctly interpret it.
Other "vanity cults" do the same thing, they get a warm fuzzy feeling from thinking they can see and interpret things in the bible that the rest of us poor slobs can't..
I once entertained a lady to tea at my place and it turned out she was a Rapturist. I asked her to explain it to me and she said-
"It means christians will vanish into thin air, leaving people looking round wondering where they've gone"
So I said- "But if drivers and pilots vanish, there'll be nobody at the controls, and cars buses, trains, trucks and planes will crash and cause death and destruction"
She replied "Yes but that can't be helped. Anyway airliners always have a nonchristian co-pilot in the cockpit to take over the controls when the christian pilot is raptured away."
I politely let her finish her tea, then kicked her out (in a nice way of course)
Other "vanity cults" do the same thing, they get a warm fuzzy feeling from thinking they can see and interpret things in the bible that the rest of us poor slobs can't..
I once entertained a lady to tea at my place and it turned out she was a Rapturist. I asked her to explain it to me and she said-
"It means christians will vanish into thin air, leaving people looking round wondering where they've gone"
So I said- "But if drivers and pilots vanish, there'll be nobody at the controls, and cars buses, trains, trucks and planes will crash and cause death and destruction"
She replied "Yes but that can't be helped. Anyway airliners always have a nonchristian co-pilot in the cockpit to take over the controls when the christian pilot is raptured away."
I politely let her finish her tea, then kicked her out (in a nice way of course)
The rapture does happen brother. Just depends when. Could be before trib (not thinking that it is imo) or the middle (more likely) & caught up right as Christ returns not thinking that this is it but maybe so we will be called up into the sky that is written. Doesn't matter to me when just know it will.The whole Rapture Cult thing is wacko anyway because it's a good example of how people take a bible passage and twist it in the belief that only they can correctly interpret it.
Other "vanity cults" do the same thing, they get a warm fuzzy feeling from thinking they can see and interpret things in the bible that the rest of us poor slobs can't..
I once entertained a lady to tea at my place and it turned out she was a Rapturist. I asked her to explain it to me and she said-
"It means christians will vanish into thin air, leaving people looking round wondering where they've gone"
So I said- "But if drivers and pilots vanish, there'll be nobody at the controls, and cars buses, trains, trucks and planes will crash and cause death and destruction"
She replied "Yes but that can't be helped. Anyway airliners always have a nonchristian co-pilot in the cockpit to take over the controls when the christian pilot is raptured away."
I politely let her finish her tea, then kicked her out (in a nice way of course)
Lurking009
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I've stated pretty clearly that because of the Bible, we can see and know the signs of His Second Coming. I'm not sure what you mean by others 'stealing my crown', but maybe check out my other posts.
As to the rapture theory, I reject it based on Biblical evidence to the contrary. Bigger picture, though: We are not saved based on eschatology, so views will differ. The problem with pre-trib is that it does not prepare people to accept tribulation and go through some serious hard times. So while this belief will not condemn people, it could lead them to reject Christ when the rapture fails to happen.
It strikes me as odd that pre-trib seems to live in the bubble of the United States. Christians all over the world are - and have been - going through tribulation in the name of Christ, but somehow Christ is only going to care when it mostly happens in the U.S.? Just something to consider.
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You don't know of the crown for those that look to HIS return? 2 tim 4:8
Lurking009
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You said: "However, we do know the season & harvest time has come and is going....winter is coming! They know it do you? Don't let anyone steal your crown for those that await HIS return."
My questions to you: Where did I say we should not look for His return? What in my posts led you to think I was saying we could not know the season? Who am I letting 'steal my crown'?? That's all I'm trying to get at. I'm just not understanding your responses to my posts.
Wasn't actually talking to you other then asked about thoughts and i let my known. The rest was for Tidal.
This is what you said:
THis is what i said: Anyone that sets a date is not talking truth. No one knows date & time PERIOD! However, we do know the season & harvest time has come and is going....winter is coming! They know it do you? Don't let anyone steal your crown for those that await HIS return. Also wasn't ENOCH around at the time of NOAH? So ENOCH walked with GOD then was no more sounds like the rapture? Precursor for a coming event? Yes i believe it is.
Lurking009
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Well, that's confusing since you quoted me and responded twice, but ok, I guess.
i quoted your thoughts and gave them whats confusing? However i do see your post after tidals and i will comment on that.
Lurking009
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You're right. Quoting me and responding to me while saying those responses were actually for Tidal is not confusing at all.
Red Sky at Morning
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In a way the question comes to the “Coming Kingdom” as talked about by Jesus or the “Kingdom Now” as promoted by Augustine…
Tidal
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It depends what you mean by "Rapture".
Sure, all Christians will get to heaven, but whether that means we'll just vanish into thin air is debatable..
Exactly!
so question do you use the latin vulgate or have one? The word rapture is latin raeptius the original greek is harpazo (1 Thessalonians 4:17) This is paul talking here. I translate everything from greek using the lexicon & latin vulgate to see what is the proper wording.It depends what you mean by "Rapture".
Sure, all Christians will get to heaven, but whether that means we'll just vanish into thin air is debatable..