"The way home or catch the fire" compared to bible/ other religions (part 6)

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
For any poor researchers who happen to find this cult down the track but don't know where to start:

please feel free to use the reference lists I provided here for https://vigilantcitizenforums.com/threads/comparison-of-jahtruths-the-way-home-or-face-the-fire-to-the-bible-part-2.10896/#post-553548.

Here is JAHtruth's alleged Holy (e)book.

Please compare all bible references to the King James Bible version, because that is the version the deliberately altered to invent his "the King of King's bible" [+ Book of Enoch, Gospel of Thomas and the Quran].

No evidence of any ancient languages qualifications has been provided by Anthony John Hill, a single JAHtruther, not even the chief spokesman @A Freeman.

---
I am reposting from my part 5 thread as I believe it explains why I will be looking from a broader perspective now:

Before I continue on the next chapter I will give some of my thoughts so far:

When I started out I thought that the ebook "the way home or face the fire" was just going to be pretty well what JAHtruthers already showed/ cut-and-pasted on every other thread. Legalism + believe in JAH or else.

I was expecting paraphrased, deliberately misquoted/ "mistranslated" Bible/Quran verses (AJH has no qualifications in ancient languages) but I also was hoping to find Anthony John Hill's self-created theology more clearly presented in the e-book.

In a way yes, AJH's new religion's ebook does gradually show what he really believes.... but it is not an ordered system of beliefs like other religions have. It is like one of those pictures that have a hidden object you cannot see until you step away from it and look from a different angle.

1687838873334.png




The pseudo-religion is a left-brained thinking person's nightmare. The more carefully I examined TWHOFTF, the more frustrated I got at all the contradictions and blatant misreading of the bible verses everywhere. Finally I realised I had to stop looking for logic, because there really is none unless you are a believer in AJH already.
Only *then* are your eyes are opened (allegedly).

The shapes and patterns on the surface are pseudo-Christianity and Islam.
Stepping back: I can see a weird blend of Gnosticism, conspiracy/ alternative health beliefs, reincarnation and anti-feminism that is anything but Christian.
I am therefore no longer going to treat it like like the worse pseudo-Christian cult EVER. I am going to treat it as the non-Christian religion it is.

P.S. I strongly suspect AJH decided to do his "translation" of the bible after the Age of the Internet made it possible for people to quickly doublecheck his references in TWHOFTF.
 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
Did AJH suddenly feel he didn't need to try and sound like the bible's writers at all any more?
The tone of the chapter 8 is suddenly different in places compared to the earlier chapters.

From this point on what looks like formal doctrine of the JAHtruth ebook will remain in Times New Roman font.
However what seems to be AJH speaking first person to the reader I will put in Courier New font.


---
8:1 After trying, over and over again, to teach people to stay-away from religions, and to talk ONLY to Him for guidance; having already sent enlightenment to the many Prophets; God decided that the only solution was to send Prince Michael, and put Him in a human-animal, to show the way YOU have to be, to be able to go home.

Here is the bible's perspective. https://www.biblestudytools.com/topical-verses/archangel-michael-in-the-bible/

Here is JAHtruth's chief apologist's perspective. https://gibraltar-messenger.net/jahtruth/who-is-the-great-prince-michael/
[Why doesn't Anthony John Hill himself ever write these articles?)

Bible scholars will weep if they see the butchery that has to be done to God's word for anyone to be able to read those verses and then concoct what @A Freeman created.
What @A Freeman did there is comparable to a criminal cutting out isolated letters/ words from magazines/ papers to create a message to the police in an attempt to disguise their identity.

1687929167109.png

The only thing that still makes me believe that AJH and AF are not the same person is that AJH's writing is somewhat entertaining in patches.

8:2 So that people would know Jesus was special,
SPECIAL?!!!!
Edit:
After further thought I realised I need to make it clear I laughed out of disbelief...

TWHOFTF itself has showed that Jesus is way beyond special.
How on Earth could AJH make such a trivialising statement?!!!

God arranged the “miracle” Virgin-birth
is AJH questioning whether Jesus was really of virgin birth?
Luke 1:27-38


Virgin Birth, doctrine of traditional Christianity that Jesus Christ had no natural father but was conceived by Mary through the power of the Holy Spirit. The doctrine that Mary was the sole natural parent of Jesus is based on the infancy narratives contained in the Gospel accounts of Matthew and Luke

and sent a spaceship, to guide shepherds to the stable, and, later-on, Druid-kings to their house, so people would know that he was here. The kings, on returning to their own countries, would tell people what they had seen, and the news would spread.
People, please read Matthew 1:18-2:14 and Luke 2:1-20

There is nothing to suggest there was a spaceship present or the wise men of the east were druids.

Matthew 2:1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,
2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.



Going on European/ Middle East maps, Israel is a long way east of the British Isles, not the other way around.


1687930612236.png


Apostle Matthew walked with Jesus 3 years. Luke was a disciple of the apostles. Trust eyewitnesses.
 
Last edited:

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
8:3 The “STAR” of Bethlehem was a spaceship; it could not possibly have been a star. Can you tell when a star is over a stable? You can not even tell when a star is over a large country, never-mind a tiny stable. Remember too, that the “STAR” guided people who were walking, or on camels.
That is a belief statement of the JAHtruth religion.
Of course it was going to be an extraordinary star if three men from the East were willing to travel so far. There is nothing to indicate that the star was something completely different. God does not lie, at least according to the BIBLE.

8:4 This was all done to show people: look; this man is different; take notice of him, and listen to what he says.
AJH proves there that despite all his alleged biblical knowledge he understands absolutely nothing about Christian doctrine. According to the CHristian worldview he is completely spiritually blind.

TWHOFTF has a 1986 copyright symbol. His self-created PERversion of the Bible has a 1997 copyright symbol.
If he had learned anything about Christianity while creating his new religion, AJH would know about Jesus' fulfilling all the prophecies about the future Messiah and would have addressed that in his ebook.

Instead all AJH says is Jesus was "special". That is such a trivialising word. Even the Muslims say Jesus is a prophet.

What DID he say? “I AM THE WAY” (home).
And as usual, TWHOFTF takes the verse completely out of context in order to deceive his followers.
John chapter 14
6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
8:5 I am the way, that each and every one of you has to be, before you can come home (John 10:7-9 & 14:2-6).

I have decided to use the colour green for the "channeling" sounding wording I have read in several questionable books.
In my opinion, this is the first place Anthony John Hill writes in the first-person to a potential believer. I strongly suspect it is to give a personal tone, to communicate in a manner similar to a spirit guide or how the reader imagines God might talk to them personally [if the mental telepathy doctrine was allegedly true].

8:6 The Jewish people had become so evil, and arrogant (Ex. 33:5),
Exodus chapter 33
Exodus 33:5 For the Lord had said unto Moses, Say unto the children of Israel, Ye are a stiffnecked people: I will come up into the midst of thee in a moment, and consume thee: therefore now put off thy ornaments from thee, that I may know what to do unto thee.
Exodus is only the second book in the bible. God said this to Moses immediately after the Israelites worshipped the gold calf in the desert. AJH wrote that to give the impression that the Israelites many centuries down the track had turned away from God!!

The subtle deceptiveness in so many places is what made me particularly hostile towards this cult.
Politicians lie in this manner. Omission of the truth because of an agenda is just as bad as deliberate lying. :mad:

with their customs and religious doctrines and traditions, that they refused to accept that Jesus was the promised Messiah, and that he brought the Living Word (John 1:1-5) of God (Mark 7:7-9).
KJV
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.


A reminder of how much AJH sometimes changes words to suit his false doctrines!!!!
KoK
John 1:1 In the Beginning was the Word (Truth - in Hebrew is Nazir), and the Truth was with God (NOT with Lucifer/Satan the Devil), and the Word was God.

Mark chapter 7
7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.


This shows how the devil uses your ego, to fool you.
That statement was just tacked on as a filler. The devil uses way more methods to deceive people than a person's ego.

It was not ego that made the Jewish leaders sin. Jesus was condemning them for their excessive legalism and keeping the commandments of MEN (Talmud).
 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
I decided to put this separately, as I realise JAHtruthers probably assume I am hardhearted or something like that.

Any JAHtruthers/ potential believers out there:

I realise you probably do genuinely desire the truth - I certainly respect that trait in people. You search for all the information out there that people/ institutions in power do sometimes hide from us all.

The changing style of communication here hits home strikes a chord with those of us who have been deeply injured by people or difficult circumstances. He is starting to reveal he knows how to tug on readers' heartstrings and people seeking meaning in their lives. I can recognise what he is up to because several abusers in my life were wordgamers just how AJH is revealing himself to be now.

If anybody should have their antennae beams on how manipulators deceive and trick people, it should be us!
If anyone who needs to be wary of those who abuse trust and kindness, it needs to be people like us!

I genuinely pray that anyone who has been fooled by this man or people like him to be set free from the spiritual and mental bondage to come to true freedom in Jesus Christ.
 
Joined
Jun 26, 2022
Messages
2,264
:3 The “STAR” of Bethlehem was a spaceship; it could not possibly have been a star. Can you tell when a star is over a stable? You can not even tell when a star is over a large country, never-mind a tiny stable. Remember too, that the “STAR” guided people who were walking, or on camels.
That is a belief statement of the JAHtruth religion.
Of course it was going to be an extraordinary star if three men from the East were willing to travel so far. There is nothing to indicate that the star
A spaceship?!

One of my favorite pastors said the star may have been an angel, and referenced when angels in the Bible are referred to as "stars", such as in revelation 1:20

Also, they didn't go to a stable as he has written here, but to a house Lk 2:11 EDIT: i was distracted, the verse is actually Matthew 2:11.

Interestingly enough, jah knows this and has written the word "house" in uppercase. Wonder why the inconsistency...?

Screenshot_20230701-173231.jpg
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jun 26, 2022
Messages
2,264
TWHOFTF has a 1986 copyright symbol. His self-created PERversion of the Bible has a 1997 copyright symbol
Oh, that explains it. When he wrote face the fire he hadn't yet gone through the Bible and was going off of the stereotypical nativity scene with wise men at the stable scene.
 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
The movie "Life of Brian" has a wonderful nativity scene.
It has been a very long time since I saw the movie so I had forgotten that scene. Since you mentioned it, I half-expected to see Monty Python have a UFO zooming in the sky background. (Why not, it is a Monty Python movie, their imagination knew no bounds....)

 

Alanantic

Star
Joined
Oct 2, 2017
Messages
1,384
It has been a very long time since I saw the movie so I had forgotten that scene. Since you mentioned it, I half-expected to see Monty Python have a UFO zooming in the sky background. (Why not, it is a Monty Python movie, their imagination knew no bounds....)

Glad you have a sense of humor. So many people here don't. :)
 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
A spaceship?!

One of my favorite pastors said the star may have been an angel, and referenced when angels in the Bible are referred to as "stars", such as in revelation 1:20
The only thing I am certain about the star is that the three wise men themselves had to be certain of what it meant to travel so far! It isn't like they had planes or cars back then.

Matthew 2:1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,
2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.



Also, they didn't go to a stable as he has written here, but to a house Lk 2:11

Interestingly enough, jah knows this and has written the word "house" in uppercase. Wonder why the inconsistency...?

View attachment 88672
Thank you for picking up TWHOFTF said stable but AJH's KoK book says HOUSE.

Note the "star" in brackets, just like he put "clouds" in brackets in the Book of Exodus. It is deliberate because it gives the appearance of supporting his self-created religion.


I see that Matthew and Luke give slightly different details where Jesus was born. I believe Luke was being exact in his wording.
Perhaps AJH had remembered that Jesus was found in a manger by the shepherds.....

Luke 2:15 And it came to pass, as the angels were gone away from them into heaven, the shepherds said one to another, Let us now go even unto Bethlehem, and see this thing which is come to pass, which the Lord hath made known unto us.
16 And they came with haste, and found Mary, and Joseph, and the babe lying in a manger.


... therefore he assumed the building Jesus was actually born in was only a stable.

(KJV) Matthew 2:10 When they [the three wise men] saw the star, they rejoiced with exceeding great joy.
11 And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him:

Luke 2:7 And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes, and laid him in a manger; because there was no room for them in the inn.


What is the meaning and significance of the manger? Christianity.com

The original language of the verse uses the Greek word kataluma for the word “inn.” This word can be translated to mean a type of boarding house, but more often, the word was used to describe a “guest chamber.

Maybe by the time the wise men had arrived, accomodation shortages caused by the census had improved by then so they were out of the stable and back in the house?


---
On the front page it says JAH publications 2014. You would think AJH would have corrected either his TWHOFTF or his KoK book by now!!!
 
Last edited:

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
Glad you have a sense of humor. So many people here don't. :)
It is a necessary trait to remain the spouse of a (now ex-) soldier!!!! I have known him 30 years, I have got used to a lot of stirring and I can usually give it back when it is needed these days.
 

TokiEl

Superstar
Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Messages
7,239
The only thing I am certain about the star is that the three wise men themselves had to be certain of what it meant to travel so far! It isn't like they had planes or cars back then.

Matthew 2:1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,
2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.


This is perhaps a prophecy concerning the constellation Leo in connection with the coming King.


Genesis 49 8“Judah, you are he whom your brothers shall praise;
Your hand shall be on the neck of your enemies;
Your father’s children shall bow down before you.
9Judah is a lion’s whelp;
From the prey, my son, you have gone up.
He bows down, he lies down as a lion;
And as a lion, who shall rouse him?
10The scepter shall not depart from Judah,
Nor a lawgiver from between his feet,
Until Shiloh comes;

And to Him shall be the obedience of the people.


If so the star gazers from east perhaps even jews who remained there after the babylonian captivity might have been intrigued by the king wandering star Jupiter's triple conjuction with the king star Regulus in the king constellation Leo ?


---

Found a utube clip which connects some dots concerning the star of Bethlehem and the birth of Jesus Christ.

 
Last edited:
Joined
Jun 26, 2022
Messages
2,264
Maybe by the time the wise men had arrived, accomodation shortages caused by the census had improved by then so they were out of the stable and back in the house?
Yeah, that's the explanation I've heard, that by the time the wise men had arrived enough time had passed (Jesus being referred to as "child" instead of of "babe") that they were living in a house.

I made a typo/distracted error in my previous post, also. I meant Matthew 2, not Luke 2, for the account of the wise men. I will fix it now.
 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
This is perhaps a prophecy concerning the constellation Leo in connection with the coming King.


Genesis 49 8“Judah, you are he whom your brothers shall praise;
Your hand shall be on the neck of your enemies;
Your father’s children shall bow down before you.
9Judah is a lion’s whelp;
From the prey, my son, you have gone up.
He bows down, he lies down as a lion;
And as a lion, who shall rouse him?
10The scepter shall not depart from Judah,
Nor a lawgiver from between his feet,
Until Shiloh comes;

And to Him shall be the obedience of the people.


If so the star gazers from east perhaps even jews who remained there after the babylonian captivity might have been intrigued by the king wandering star Jupiter's triple conjuction with the king star Regulus in the king constellation Leo ?


---

Found a utube clip which connects some dots concerning the star of Bethlehem and the birth of Jesus Christ.

That is a very interesting theory you have there!
I have never considered star constellations at the time of Jesus so I looked the topic up to see if other Christian writers have considered the possibility.

 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
8:7 Jesus disappeared, after his birth and the Druids’ visit,
There is nothing in the bible to suggest the three wise men could possibly be druids, unless you believe Acts 29 belongs in the bible. [I had to use JAHtruth link for reference, as no real bible website has Acts chapter 29 included).

Druid - Wikipedia
A druid was a member of the high-ranking priestly class in ancient Celtic cultures. Druids were religious leaders as well as legal authorities, adjudicators, lorekeepers, medical professionals and political advisors....

A paragraph down says the following (which should make people wonder if AJH has some neo-druid beliefs or at least been culturally influenced by them)?

The druids appear in some of the medieval tales from Christianized Ireland like "Táin Bó Cúailnge", where they are largely portrayed as sorcerers who opposed the coming of Christianity.[6] In the wake of the Celtic revival during the 18th and 19th centuries, fraternal and neopagan groups were founded based on ideas about the ancient druids, a movement known as Neo-Druidism. Many popular notions about druids, based on misconceptions of 18th-century scholars, have been largely superseded by more recent study.[7]

---
No genuine translation of the bible provides Acts chapter 29.

The lost chapter of the Acts of the Apostles -Wikipedia

The text made its first appearance in London in 1871.[2] According to the editor, it was translated in the late 18th century by the French naturalist Sonnini de Manoncourt from a "Greek manuscript discovered in the archives at Constantinople and presented to him by the Sultan Abdoul Achmet". It was found hidden in an English translation of Sonnini's Voyage en Grèce et en Turquie in the library of Sir John Newport, MP (1756–1843) after his death. However, no trace of any such manuscript has been found, and from internal evidence, mainstream philology considers it to most likely be a fraud, thus it is classed among the modern pseudepigrapha....

Thankfully Wikipedia gave a link that provides an actual copy of the chapter - scroll two thirds down page.

Edgar J.Goodspeed, strange new Gospels

Introduction:
FOR many years there has prevailed in certain quarters in England the idea that the Anglo-Saxon peoples are the lost ten tribes of Israel who were carried into captivity by Assyria in 722 B.C., and have never been heard of since. The holders of this "British-Israel" position declare that the national seal of the United States bears witness to our identity with the tribe of Manasseh, the thirteenth tribe (Gen. 49:24, Hos. 14:6, etc.), while the royal arms of Britain recall those of Ephraim and Judah (Gen. 49:9, Deut. 33:17, etc.)

AJH couldn't even leave that (alleged) chapter alone though.

29:13. And it came to pass that certain of the Druids came unto Paul privately, and showed by their rites and ceremonies they were descended from the Jews which escaped from bondage in the land of Egypt, and the apostle believed these things, and he gave them the kiss of peace.

KoK 29:13 And it came to pass that certain of the Druids (Druid means Truth) came unto Paul privately, and showed by their rites and ceremonies they were descended from the Jews which escaped from bondage in the land of Egypt, and the Apostle believed these things, and he gave them the kiss of peace.

---
The claim that druid really means truth is so dumb. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/druid
druid
noun
dru·id ˈdrü-id

often capitalized
: one of an ancient Celtic priesthood appearing in Irish and Welsh sagas and Christian legends as magicians and wizards.


----
for more than 30 years,
Is AJH really claiming Jesus was with the DRUIDS for more than 30 years?!!!! That is a new one....

with the single exception of when he was 12 years old (Luke 2:42), at the Feast of the Passover, when he was talking to the priests in The Temple, and amazing them, with his great knowledge.
That is the one thing that is almost accurate in the sentence. The information is poorly presented and gives the reader little insight as usual.

Luke 2:41 Now his parents went to Jerusalem every year at the feast of the passover.
42 And when he was twelve years old, they went up to Jerusalem after the custom of the feast.
43 And when they had fulfilled the days, as they returned, the child Jesus tarried behind in Jerusalem; and Joseph and his mother knew not of it.
44 But they, supposing him to have been in the company, went a day's journey; and they sought him among their kinsfolk and acquaintance.
45 And when they found him not, they turned back again to Jerusalem, seeking him.
46 And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions.
47 And all that heard him were astonished at his understanding and answers.
 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
8:8 He disappeared, because he had to learn, in private, exactly what it was like, to submit to human limitations, and to be, to all intents and purposes, a normal human+being.
There is nothing in the bible to support TWHOFTF's claim.
Matthew 2:12-23
An angel told Joseph to take Mary and Jesus to Egypt, and then after King Herod died an angel told Joseph to go to Israel.

Only other religions would support AJH's claim that Jesus went to other countries as well.

8:9 He had to learn everything, about all the different types and degrees of temptation, and how to overcome them. If he didn’t, he could not possibly help others, to overcome theirs, or be able to complete his mission. Before you can help anyone, you have to not only understand their problem, but how to solve it too. To do that, you have to have solved it yourself, many times over.

That sounds like AJH doesn't believe Jesus was all-knowing, and that Jesus was completely without sin.
 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
These following "verses" shouldn't make me laugh, but they do. :oops:
I have watched too much old British comedy series and it brings back memories of Benny Hill, Monty Python and the "Carry on..." movies.
It is so unlike the Bible's wording, it it is ridiculously sad.

8:10 He had to experiment with women, and had to learn how to resist their temptation, because his mission was far too important, to let anyone, or anything, get in the way.
Experiment with women?!!!! AJH's Jesus is not holy then.
That type of statement makes me think AJH is projecting his own past onto Jesus, since he alleges he is Jesus "reborn in a new body" (reincarnated to the rest of us).

Hebrews 4:14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.
15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.


8:11 He needed time, to get used to controlling his human-animal-body, that Mary’s body had made, and that he was locked-inside-of. He had to learn to control it, to such a fine degree, that he could not be tempted, by love for a woman, into failing to complete his mission. Satan sent as many beautiful, sexy women as possible,
That is the phrase that made me think of this scene where the soldier has to battle with temptations....


to try to pull him away, and even offered to give him the whole world, if he would serve him, instead of God.

AJH is blending his personal theories about Jesus struggling with lust towards women and with the biblical account of Jesus being tempted by Satan in the desert.
Matthew 4:1-11
 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
I am not going to comment on TWHOFTF's calendar theory as it probably deserves another thread to be looked at properly.

8:12 Jesus obviously could not start His work, until his body was in its late-thirties, because, as a teenager, no-one would take him seriously, and he would be far too inexperienced, in worldly-matters, to be able to cope with abuse and ridicule, without losing his temper. Jesus’ ministry was NOT from 30-33 years of age, but from 33-40 (Dan. 9:27) years of age. Today’s calendar is seven years out (inarrears) and this year is actually 1993 A.D., not 1986. As it was; even in his late-thirties; he could not get the majority of the people to take him seriously.

Look at what I have underlined above.
I would love a psychoanalyst to go through what TWHOFTF says with a fine tooth comb. The amount of projection that is starting to occur now should be especially obvious to people who have done any psychology/ counselling training in their life.
Projection - psychology today

According to the BIBLE Jesus was without sin. That means he did not lose his temper.
Jesus would have not been simmering with resentment and self-pity for not being taken seriously by people.

There is NOTHING in the bible to suggest people didn't take Jesus seriously!!!! The Jewish leaders took Jesus so seriously they tried to stone Him on several occasions before they finally managed to hand Jesus over to the Romans.
 

JoChris

Superstar
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
6,168
8:13 Once his training was completed,
That is AJH's theory only....

he started to teach people to leave organized-religion,
Note no bible verse given....

and go into their closets to speak to God.

He did not quote the bible passage on purpose.

Matthew 6:5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.


8:13 Once his training was completed, he started to teach people to leave organized-religion, and go into their closets to speak to God. Jesus was pulling people away from the church and their organized religion, and was teaching them by the sea and on the mountain-sides, and the priests were losing their prestige, and the respect of the people, and their power over the people, and they were also losing MONEY.
The church did not exist at this stage! AJH is getting really sloppy now.

All the financial issues and prestige and status creating extra enmity between Jesus and some Jewish leaders is feasible but it is a minor issue compared to what the bible actually says.
They accused Jesus of blasphemy!!!!
Matthew 26:59-66

Did AJH have money problems while writing the book? He put MONEY in capital letters after all.

The churches’ lucrative business was crumbling, so they had to find a way to stop Jesus, and they tried to trick him, into saying something, for which they could prosecute him (by their own laws/legislation, NOT God’s Laws) and have him killed; but he was far too clever for them.... (Mark 12:13 & Luke 11:54 & 20:20).
There is nothing in the bible to suggest that "the business system" was crumbling at all.

Read the chapters. They were trying to trip Jesus up via trick questions because He rebuked them for their hypocrisy and their own misuse of God's laws to gain advantage over the Jewish people.

Mark chapter 12
Luke chapter 11
Luke chapter 20

If anything, those Jewish leaders sound insecure, prone to losing their temper and unable to be taken seriously by the Jewish people (similar to what AJH alleged Jesus must have felt like when Jesus was growing up in 8:12).

Above in 8:12 TWHOFTF says Jesus wasn't taken seriously, in 8:13 it says Jesus was too clever for them.
Does AJH think Jesus suddenly become a genius overnight or something?
 
Last edited:
Top