Aisha's age at the time of her marriage

TempestOfTempo

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Wasnt the Quran written in Syriac or Aramaic language and much later it was translated to arabic?
Some people say in original aramaic language the meaning of many things is quite different than in arabic and there are some translation errors in Quran.


My knowledge about islam is rather dim so i dont know about the Aisha marriage thingy enough to have an opinion about it.I have watched dozens of Sheik Imran Hosein lectures about Islam and Gog&MaGog but i dont recall him mentioning this topic.If anybody can give a short backstory why they married (was it like political marriage to unite two different houses or territories etc).Im curious to know but too lazy/tired at the moment to research it myself.
Was the prophet married directly to her or was there betrothal ? There is a difference and back in those days in those areas ,betrothal was the way to go.

Jesus spoke Aramaic, which is why Muslims note he would refer to God as "Ala" which is different than "Allah" and my understanding is that it still meant "one true Creator" however I am no scholar. As far as Quran I believe it was revealed in Arabic to Muhammed and therefore its first, complete accounts (both oral and written) would have also been in classic (Quaranic) Arabic form. I can also check out your article link to check out what it states as well.
Edit: I just read the brief article... while it is certainly relevant to our discussion, that article and its contentions should have its own thread. If you post one here in the religious section, we can engage regarding these notions in a more substantive and less distractive effort. It does raise some interesting contentions though...
 

TrollingTroubles

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Wasnt the Quran written in Syriac or Aramaic language and much later it was translated to arabic?
No, it was revealed to Muhammed (peace and blessings of God be upon him) through Gabriel the archangel, in the language Muhammad spoke, Arabic. It was taught by Muhammad to his companions and they then recited from memory, but it wasn’t until 30 years after his death that it was committed to writing. It was written in Arabic without vowel marking because the Arabs didn’t need them in order to read their language. It wasn’t until Islam began to spread to non Arabic speaking nations that the vowel markings were added, in order to better preserve the Quran and to make it easier for non Arabs to learn the recitations

My knowledge about islam is rather dim so i dont know about the Aisha marriage thingy enough to have an opinion about it.I have watched dozens of Sheik Imran Hosein lectures about Islam and Gog&MaGog but i dont recall him mentioning this topic.If anybody can give a short backstory why they married (was it like political marriage to unite two different houses or territories etc).Im curious to know but too lazy/tired at the moment to research it myself.
Was the prophet married directly to her or was there betrothal ? There is a difference and back in those days in those areas ,betrothal was the way to go.
I’ll give you the short version, for the long version - this thread serves enough lol

ok, so the Prophet Muhammad (May the peace and blessings of God be upon him) was notified by God in a dream (which for prophets is also revelation but of a different kind) that his marriage to Aisha was decided in Heaven and therefore he is married to her. The prophet Muhammed revealed his dream to his closest confidant and best friend, Abu Bakr who just happened to also be the father of Aisha. Abu Bakr didn’t hesitate and gave his blessing and they got married. By all estimates, Aisha was between 6 and 16 years of age when she was married to Muhammed. But it wasn’t until some years later that the marriage was consummated.

There are some differences of opinion in the modern age regarding her age, but it has never been a topic of concern for Muslims or even the enemies of Muslims who would seek to destroy the reputation of Muhammed in ancient times.

I, personally have no issue with it. What I find annoying is the childish insistence of some people here applying the norms of today to the very different norms of 7th century Arabia.

These revisionist narratives take something wholly pure and seek to marr it with their flawed and limited understanding of anthropology and their again flawed and limited understanding of objective morality. Worse, these same so-called Muslims (who quote the bible more than they quote the Quran btw) tend to write those of us off who do not agree with them 100% (with no room for nuanced understanding either) as kiddy fiddlers. Seriously, like wtf!

Anyway, I hope I have answered your questions. I don’t visit here that much anymore so I am unsure whether I will be able to answer you if you post a reply. I don’t find this place that enlightening anymore. I wonder if I ever did.
 

TrollingTroubles

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You wish, so desperately, for that to be true... instead your contention struck out at the plate, you never even made it to first base. So by all means, please continue exposing yourselves here... both the fact that you are wrong regarding Aisha's age... and the fact that you know this is a lie, yet still utilize this discredited blasphemy to promote your centuries old perversion of Islam in order to justify your agenda of child trafficking, r*pe and murder.
Wanker!
 

TempestOfTempo

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No, it was revealed to Muhammed (peace and blessings of God be upon him) through Gabriel the archangel, in the language Muhammad spoke, Arabic. It was taught by Muhammad to his companions and they then recited from memory, but it wasn’t until 30 years after his death that it was committed to writing. It was written in Arabic without vowel marking because the Arabs didn’t need them in order to read their language. It wasn’t until Islam began to spread to non Arabic speaking nations that the vowel markings were added, in order to better preserve the Quran and to make it easier for non Arabs to learn the recitations



I’ll give you the short version, for the long version - this thread serves enough lol

ok, so the Prophet Muhammad (May the peace and blessings of God be upon him) was notified by God in a dream (which for prophets is also revelation but of a different kind) that his marriage to Aisha was decided in Heaven and therefore he is married to her. The prophet Muhammed revealed his dream to his closest confidant and best friend, Abu Bakr who just happened to also be the father of Aisha. Abu Bakr didn’t hesitate and gave his blessing and they got married. By all estimates, Aisha was between 6 and 16 years of age when she was married to Muhammed. But it wasn’t until some years later that the marriage was consummated.

There are some differences of opinion in the modern age regarding her age, but it has never been a topic of concern for Muslims or even the enemies of Muslims who would seek to destroy the reputation of Muhammed in ancient times.

I, personally have no issue with it. What I find annoying is the childish insistence of some people here applying the norms of today to the very different norms of 7th century Arabia.

These revisionist narratives take something wholly pure and seek to marr it with their flawed and limited understanding of anthropology and their again flawed and limited understanding of objective morality. Worse, these same so-called Muslims (who quote the bible more than they quote the Quran btw) tend to write those of us off who do not agree with them 100% (with no room for nuanced understanding either) as kiddy fiddlers. Seriously, like wtf!

Anyway, I hope I have answered your questions. I don’t visit here that much anymore so I am unsure whether I will be able to answer you if you post a reply. I don’t find this place that enlightening anymore. I wonder if I ever did.
You and your crowd were vehement that Aisha was 6-9 during marriage and consummation. Now that other posters have realized how toxic you people are and you guys are starting to get banned from here for openly promoting child sex-trafficking, r*pe and murder you are switching up to "16" but as everyone can see... you wont renounce the claim of 6 years old. These are the same games you perverts and child-predators have been playing for centuries and the more you post, the more you expose yourselves.
 

TrollingTroubles

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You and your crowd were vehement that Aisha was 6-9 during marriage and consummation. Now that other posters have realized how toxic you people are and you guys are starting to get banned from here for openly promoting child sex-trafficking, r*pe and murder you are switching up to "16" but as everyone can see... you wont renounce the claim of 6 years old. These are the same games you perverts and child-predators have been playing for centuries and the more you post, the more you expose yourselves.
I never said she wasn’t in her teens, go check thru my posts. I said it can’t be proven either way. And that’s where you got your g-string all twisted up.

btw, who got banned Lol
 

TempestOfTempo

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I never said she wasn’t in her teens, go check thru my posts. I said it can’t be proven either way. And that’s where you got your g-string all twisted up.

btw, who got banned Lol
Everyone can see what you have posted over time. You people exposed yourselves.
 

TrollingTroubles

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Everyone can see what you have posted over time. You people exposed yourselves.
You haven’t proven anything except how you’re wet in your panties for this topic. Trust me, it’s not healthy for you to keep doing this to yourself. Not to mention how you come off like a wank stain on your daddies jocks every time you reply to someone who doesn’t agree with you.

but never mind that for now. Tell me, who got banned? And why?
 

TempestOfTempo

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Your vulgarity and homo/incestuous rhetoric only does more to further your exposure... as for who got banned, you are pouring over these threads like its your job lol so feel free to enlighten yourself...
 

TrollingTroubles

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As I said, you come off like a wank stain on your dads jocks.

Also, I guess no one got banned, and as usual you are just claiming it is so because you want to be the victor.

You internet waste man!
 

TempestOfTempo

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As I said, you come off like a wank stain on your dads jocks.

Also, I guess no one got banned, and as usual you are just claiming it is so because you want to be the victor.

You internet waste man!
You are so intellectually deficient that apparently, you cant put 2 and 2 together regarding the posts you just claimed to have read lol
You cant help but spew your homo-incetuous verbiage here either. Its what you are... its who you people are. Thank God almighty you and your sad crew are exposing your true selves to the world here...
 

TrollingTroubles

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You are so intellectually deficient that apparently, you cant put 2 and 2 together regarding the posts you just claimed to have read lol
You cant help but spew your homo-incetuous verbiage here either. Its what you are... its who you people are. Thank God almighty you and your sad crew are exposing your true selves to the world here...
You know what they say about people who accuse others of being gay?

They be in denial of being gay themselves.
 
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Dirtbag daze, desert corpse flower, trolling for life, fiend and the rest... these are the wages of your sin. On the mighty day of judgement, there will be no more lies to tell in defense of this horror. Its just a game to you all, a joke. I hope you all burn in the pits of hell for the blasphemous fitna you support...
Utterly barbaric. I was aware of some of that stuff but Saudi Arabia really is living in the middle ages.
 

amaranthine

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No, it was revealed to Muhammed (peace and blessings of God be upon him) through Gabriel the archangel, in the language Muhammad spoke, Arabic. It was taught by Muhammad to his companions and they then recited from memory, but it wasn’t until 30 years after his death that it was committed to writing. It was written in Arabic without vowel marking because the Arabs didn’t need them in order to read their language. It wasn’t until Islam began to spread to non Arabic speaking nations that the vowel markings were added, in order to better preserve the Quran and to make it easier for non Arabs to learn the recitations



I’ll give you the short version, for the long version - this thread serves enough lol

ok, so the Prophet Muhammad (May the peace and blessings of God be upon him) was notified by God in a dream (which for prophets is also revelation but of a different kind) that his marriage to Aisha was decided in Heaven and therefore he is married to her. The prophet Muhammed revealed his dream to his closest confidant and best friend, Abu Bakr who just happened to also be the father of Aisha. Abu Bakr didn’t hesitate and gave his blessing and they got married. By all estimates, Aisha was between 6 and 16 years of age when she was married to Muhammed. But it wasn’t until some years later that the marriage was consummated.

There are some differences of opinion in the modern age regarding her age, but it has never been a topic of concern for Muslims or even the enemies of Muslims who would seek to destroy the reputation of Muhammed in ancient times.

I, personally have no issue with it. What I find annoying is the childish insistence of some people here applying the norms of today to the very different norms of 7th century Arabia.

These revisionist narratives take something wholly pure and seek to marr it with their flawed and limited understanding of anthropology and their again flawed and limited understanding of objective morality. Worse, these same so-called Muslims (who quote the bible more than they quote the Quran btw) tend to write those of us off who do not agree with them 100% (with no room for nuanced understanding either) as kiddy fiddlers. Seriously, like wtf!

Anyway, I hope I have answered your questions. I don’t visit here that much anymore so I am unsure whether I will be able to answer you if you post a reply. I don’t find this place that enlightening anymore. I wonder if I ever did.
So anything goes eh? Your stance is a stance of relativism where what is evil changes depending on what culture you are in. So if a culture today (or back in the day) practiced human sacrifice, then it would be ok if it is/was a norm.
 

Maldarker

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So anything goes eh? Your stance is a stance of relativism where what is evil changes depending on what culture you are in. So if a culture today (or back in the day) practiced human sacrifice, then it would be ok if it is/was a norm.
Well yeah lock step in-line with the cults of baal & moloch is what you see as an end result of relativism. Your seeing it play out today just the actors & names where changed to protect the guilty LOL
 
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Behumble

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What not to follow:

˹Consider the Day˺ when those who misled others will disown their followers—when they face the torment—and the bonds that united them will be cut off.
2:166

When it is said to them, “Follow what Allah has revealed,” they reply, “No! We ˹only˺ follow what we found our forefathers practicing.” ˹Would they still do so,˺ even if their forefathers had ˹absolutely˺ no understanding or guidance?
2:170

And it is Allah’s Will to turn to you in grace, but those who follow their desires wish to see you deviate entirely ˹from Allah’s Way˺.
4:27

We have revealed to you ˹O Prophet˺ this Book with the truth, as a confirmation of previous Scriptures and a supreme authority on them. So judge between them by what Allah has revealed, and do not follow their desires over the truth that has come to you. To each of you We have ordained a code of law and a way of life. If Allah had willed, He would have made you one community, but His Will is to test you with what He has given ˹each of˺ you. So compete with one another in doing good. To Allah you will all return, then He will inform you ˹of the truth˺ regarding your differences
5:47

Say, “O People of the Book! Do not go to extremes in your faith beyond the truth, nor follow the vain desires of those who went astray before ˹you˺. They misled many and strayed from the Right Way.”
5:77

Most of them follow nothing but ˹inherited˺ assumptions. ˹And˺ surely assumptions can in no way replace the truth. Allah is indeed All-Knowing of what they do.
10:36

Do not follow what you have no ˹sure˺ knowledge of. Indeed, all will be called to account for ˹their˺ hearing, sight, and intellect.
17:36

But they were succeeded by generations who neglected prayer and followed their lusts and so will soon face the evil consequences.
19:59

So if they fail to respond to you, then know that they only follow their desires. And who could be more astray than those who follow their desires with no guidance from Allah? Surely Allah does not guide the wrongdoing people.
28:50

In fact, they say, “We found our forefathers following a ˹particular˺ way, and we are following in their footsteps.”
43:22

Similarly, whenever We sent a warner to a society before you ˹O Prophet˺, its ˹spoiled˺ elite would say, “We found our forefathers following a ˹particular˺ way, and we are walking in their footsteps.”
43:23

Can those ˹believers˺ who stand on clear proof from their Lord be like those whose evil deeds are made appealing to them and ˹only˺ follow their desires?
47:14

although they have no knowledge ˹in support˺ of this. They follow nothing but ˹inherited˺ assumptions. And surely assumptions can in no way replace the truth.
53:28


What to follow and what not to follow:

Now We have set you ˹O Prophet˺ on the ˹clear˺ Way of faith. So follow it, and do not follow the desires of those who do not know ˹the truth˺.
45:18


What to follow:

Those We have given the Book follow it as it should be followed. It is they who ˹truly˺ believe in it. As for those who reject it, it is they who are the losers.
2:121

religion.” Say, ˹O Prophet,˺ “Surely, ˹the only˺ true guidance is Allah’s guidance.” ˹They also said,˺ “Do not believe that someone will receive ˹revealed˺ knowledge similar to yours or argue against you before your Lord.” Say, ˹O Prophet,˺ “Indeed, all bounty is in the Hands of Allah—He grants it to whoever He wills. And Allah is All-Bountiful, All-Knowing.”
3:73

Say, ˹O Prophet,˺ “I do not say to you that I possess Allah’s treasuries or know the unseen, nor do I claim to be an angel. I only follow what is revealed to me.” Say, “Are those blind ˹to the truth˺ equal to those who can see? Will you not then reflect?”
6:50

These ˹prophets˺ were ˹rightly˺ guided by Allah, so follow their guidance. Say, “I ask no reward of you for this ˹Quran˺—it is a reminder to the whole world.”
6:90

˹O Prophet!˺ Follow what is revealed to you from your Lord—there is no god ˹worthy of worship˺ except Him—and turn away from the polytheists.
6:106

This is a blessed Book We have revealed. So follow it and be mindful ˹of Allah˺, so you may be shown mercy.
6:155

If you ˹O Prophet˺ do not bring them a sign ˹which they demanded˺, they ask, “Why do you not make it yourself?” Say, “I only follow what is revealed to me from my Lord. This ˹Quran˺ is an insight from your Lord—a guide and a mercy for those who believe.”
7:203

When Our clear revelations are recited to them, those who do not expect to meet Us say ˹to the Prophet˺, “Bring us a different Quran or make some changes in it.” Say ˹to them˺, “It is not for me to change it on my own. I only follow what is revealed to me. I fear, if I were to disobey my Lord, the punishment of a tremendous Day.”
10:15

And follow what is revealed to you, and be patient until Allah passes His judgment. For He is the Best of Judges.
10:109

Allah said, “Descend, both of you, from here together ˹with Satan˺ as enemies to each other. Then when guidance comes to you from Me, whoever follows My guidance will neither go astray ˹in this life˺ nor suffer ˹in the next˺.
20:123

For every community We appointed a code of life to follow. So do not let them dispute with you ˹O Prophet˺ in this matter. And invite ˹all˺ to your Lord, for you are truly on the Right Guidance.
22:67

Follow what is revealed to you from your Lord. Surely Allah is All-Aware of what you ˹all˺ do.
33:2

those who listen to what is said and follow the best of it. These are the ones ˹rightly˺ guided by Allah, and these are ˹truly˺ the people of reason.
39:18

Follow ˹the Quran,˺ the best of what has been revealed to you from your Lord, before the punishment takes you by surprise while you are unaware,
39:55

Say, “I am not the first messenger ever sent, nor do I know what will happen to me or you. I only follow what is revealed to me. And I am only sent with a clear warning.”
46:9


You get my drift
 

TrollingTroubles

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So anything goes eh? Your stance is a stance of relativism where what is evil changes depending on what culture you are in. So if a culture today (or back in the day) practiced human sacrifice, then it would be ok if it is/was a norm.
No, cultural relativism has it’s uses, sure. Food choices are a good example of cultural relativism because people have become more tolerant of food from cultures that are not their own. In the past people were more likely to find some types of foods unacceptable, but now they are more likely to not judge others based on their food choices.

But the same can not be said when morality is objective and yet passed off as subject to any given time and place. Hitler killing Jews was morally ok in Germany in those times - yet - fast forward today and it could never happen again in Germany.

But in many parts of the world, the female of the species are getting married as young as 9 years of age even today, and this has nothing to do with cultural relativism because it’s something that is a constant and not dependent on the norms of another culture elswhere. For example, It is estimated that 76 percent of Niger’s girls marry before the age of 18, and 28 percent marry before the age of 15. In Trinidad and Tobago, some girls marry as young as 12. I could go on but you get the point, it’s not cultural relativism if you do not accept it to be the norm today, which you most probably will not. What this does demonstrate is that a norm cannot be ascertained by any universal measure when the measures themselves are extant in varying degrees around the world throughout the ages. And that nuance, flies over the head of dick fingered bozos like ToT who love a good scratch n sniff card to wipe their boogers onto.
 
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