Does God Suffer?

Karlysymon

Karlysymon

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Etagloc said:
@Haich
and @Kung Fu

Yes I think that is something that is interesting.....

I think from a Christian perspective.... it seems like the answer, at least to me, would be yes (but it could go either way)

Whereas from an Islamic perspective, I think it would be no.

So this brings up something I find interesting- what is the difference between God in the Quran and in the Bible?

I think the Christian side would be to say God is more distant in the Quran and I think the Muslim side would be to say God in the Bible is made to be too much like a human.
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The OT portrays, countless times, a God who wants to be initmately involved in the lives of His creation. More often, the symbol of husband/wife , Father/child is employed, and for a reason. And God wants us to view Him that way, thats why Christianity is accused of making Him too human. And as i understand, Islam doesn't encourage/forbids calling God, 'Father'.

Take for example the Book of Hosea, from the outset, the prophet was instructed to marry a prostitute and in doing so, he would better understand both positions (God/us) while delivering the message.

The LORD said to me, ‘Go, show your love to your wife again, though she is loved by another man and
is an adulteress. Love her as the LORD loves the
Israelites, though they turn to other gods and love the sacred raisin cakes.’- Hosea 3:1

I thought you could call me “Father” and not turn away from following Me.Jer 3:19-20

Etagloc said:
Exactly! I sort of think the same way- if God loves, doesn't that mean he suffers when he sees things like genocide, tragedies, etc.?

But then.... wouldn't it be a violation of God's Godness?

I sort of go back and forth. I think Kung Fu and Haich make strong arguments. But it is hard for me to imagine a God who doesn't suffer. But does that say something about God or about my imagination- I might just be trying to imagine God in an overly human-like way.

Does it violate God's perfection?

I mean when God sees the Holocaust or the genocide against the Palestinians or the genocide in Rwanda or even just poverty...... it is hard for me to imagine God doesn't suffer in some way.

But like I said, that might just be me imagining God as being overly human-like.
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Does God suffer? Yes He does.

love=>freewill=>suffering

Love (not romance) makes freewill and suffering possible. It is freewill that makes it possible to reject love/the other person's desire for your highest good. And rejection hurts. Without freewill, iam an automaton....like the sun, i cannot refuse to shine.
 
floss

floss

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elsbet said:
Even worse than denying Allah and Muhammed?
Serious question.
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It’s fine to deny the Son of God, but if you denied Muhammad being the last and final prophet, you’re not a muslim... how ironic

Judaism is the religion of the Synagogue of Satan, no wonder why its so compatible with Islam as they both denied the only way to the Father.
 
elsbet

elsbet

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floss said:
It’s fine to deny the Son of God, but if you denied Muhammad being the last and final prophet, you’re not a muslim... how ironic

Judaism is the religion of the Synagogue of Satan, no wonder why its so compatible with Islam as they both denied the only way to the Father.
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I think that applies those who pretend to be Jews, but they really aren't. Is that what you're talking about?
 
K

Kung Fu

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elsbet said:
Even worse than denying Allah and Muhammed?
Serious question.
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Denying Allah aka the Most High falls somewhat falls in the same category as associating partners with Him. It's all one and the same at the end because if you die in a state of associating partners with the Most High or denying His existence all together it's an unforgivable sin. However, if you would like to get technical logically speaking denying the Creator all together is stronger in disbelieve than associating partners with Him.

I've answered the question on Muhammad(pbuh) multiple times so I don't know why this is being brought up again and again. As Muslims we can't deny any of the prophets. You can't believe in Muhammad(pbuh) and not believe in Abraham(pbuh) and or vice versa. Muslims can't pick and choose which prophets they want to believe in and which they don't. Muslims, according to the Quran have to believe in all the prophets, that the Most High is One, and that there will be a Final Day where all of humanity is judged.

The Quran makes it clear that nothing in terms of sin is worse than associating partners with the Most High/denying His existence.
 
K

Kung Fu

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floss said:
It’s fine to deny the Son of God, but if you denied Muhammad being the last and final prophet, you’re not a muslim... how ironic

Judaism is the religion of the Synagogue of Satan, no wonder why its so compatible with Islam as they both denied the only way to the Father.
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Floss, I know you're a bit slow and uneducated but please try to keep up. You're not a Muslim in the technical sense if you deny Jesus(pbuh) and believe in Muhammad(pbuh). Muslims can't pick and choose which prophets they want to believe in and which they don't. This is now the third time I've corrected you on this but I know you don't care because you're trying to be deceitful.

When you say son of god are you talking about Adam(pbuh), David(pbuh), and or Jesus(pbuh) lol? You're really going to have to be more specific.

Judaism might be corrupt but at least they got grade 1 math down to a competent level :)
 
floss

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Ok maybe you didn’t understand.

If you accepted all other prophets but denied muhammad (since he is a false prophet), are you a muslim?
 
K

Kung Fu

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floss said:
Ok maybe you didn’t understand.

If you accepted all other prophets but denied muhammad (since he is a false prophet), are you a muslim?
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No, you didn't understand. You have a reading comprehension my slow friend. You can't be considered a Muslim in the technical sense if you DENY any of the prophets. You're not a Muslim if you deny Muhammad(pbuh), you're not a Muslim if you deny Jesus, you're not a Muslim if you deny Abraham(pbuh), and etc. This isn't rocket science.

You call Muhammad(pbuh) a false prophet yet believe in the self appointed Paul as an apostle. The irony is strong in you.
 
floss

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conclusion: you can’t be a muslim without professing muhammad as the beloved last and final prophet. (assigning partner to allah, shirksss!) The emphasis of islam is on muhammad.(assigning partner to allah, shirksss!) One can’t possibly be a muslim without muhammad as the cult leader.(assigning partner to allah, shirksss!) If you profess muhammad as a false prophet but believe in allah, you’re not a muslim...The end
 
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K

Kung Fu

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floss said:
conclusion: you can’t be a muslim without professing muhammad as the beloved last and final prophet. (assigning partner to allah, shirksss!) The emphasis of islam is on muhammad.(assigning partner to allah, shirksss!) One can’t possibly be a muslim without muhammad as the cult leader.(assigning partner to allah, shirksss!) If you profess muhammad as a false prophet but believe in allah, you’re not a muslim...The end
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Why did you ask me a question if that's not the answer you wanted to hear? You keep making up your own nonsense denying history and reality. And you wanted to go door to door in order to bring people to Christianity lol. Boy, you would get schooled against anyone that had half a brain lol. I pray to the Most High day and night that people like you come to my door so I can teach you a lesson and see you squirm not being able to answer my questions.

Floss, this is why no one takes you seriously on here.
 
floss

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can I be a muslim without accepting muhammad as the last and final prophet?
 
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